Jocks

[Sportsbuck]

So then, what would be the reason behind athletes grades being higher than non-athletes grades?

/Waits for accusations of grade fixing.

[Freak93]

sportsbuck2745 said:

So then, what would be the reason behind athletes grades being higher than non-athletes grades?

/Waits for accusations of grade fixing.

If students with disadvantages are grouped in then I think it is obvious.

[Sportsbuck]

For you guys that are saying athletes take easier classes.. guess again.

Closely tied to the GPA is the selection of academic majors. Critics might suggest that athletes' GPA's are high because they enroll in easier academic degree programs, therefore, taking easier classes than their peers. To discover whether this was true, Jones (1995-96) also studied the majors and colleges of the athletes. Results were tabulated and percentages were then used to compare college selection of athlets to non-athletes. The study showed that the student athletes were not selecting what were perceived as easier majors than the general student body. The research has suggested that co-curricular involvement helps create better students. Since the majority of co-curricular participants are involved in athletics, it is encouraging to find that athletic participation does result in higher grade point averages.

[Keeper]

I'm talking high school courses, people who get into college are going to take the majors that interest them. How they're getting in those schools is a different story

[Sportsbuck]

God, you are terrible. Seriously, you are so judgmental.. Oh yeah, an athlete gets into college, he must've gotten his grades fixed, or had help getting in. I mean, Jesus, give an athlete a little credit once in a while.

You want high school stats and history.. I give you this: www.iahsaa.org/hsactiv.htm

[sep]

A link to the Iowa High School Athletic Association? Oh :-0

[I am a huge CUNT]

I really don't see how you all keep missing what Sportsbuck is saying.

[Claytons Crew]

I played HS football and started my last 2 years. I just took the basic core classes and made mostly B's with an A or C here and there. The only thing I am really guilty of is when it was football season my teachers would give me about 2 extra days to turn in homework. Of course I took advantage of it. Also, when they gave random notebook checks I would say I forgot it in my locker and they would say alright I'll give you a B anyways.

[Freak93]

It is flawed though. Think about it, the results Sportsbuck posted have athletes in one category, then non-athletes in another. The non-athlete group containing those who are disadvantaged in the classroom. Not to mention the difference in pure numbers. How many more non-athletes are there than athletes?

Also, athletes have a minimum GPA to meet. Let's say that is 2.8. So, if they fall drastically under that, what do they become? Non-athletes. So right there, it is another problem.

We need to find research that randomly surveys let's say 30 people in each category. It would also be nice to find research conducted by a non-bias person. The first article Sportsbuck posted was comprised by the head football coach in a tight money situation. I am not saying the results are flawed at all, but for it to be taken seriously, outsiders are needed.

The second link to the Iowa High School Athletic Association was also a good start. The problem with that was it simply stated high school activities which can range from athletics to theater. A lot of the quotes there were also simply opinions without clear statistics stated.

(To be honest, the best results would be SAT/ACT scores, or possibly IQ scores.)

[cooljayhu]

IQ scores have very little bearing on how smart you are. It just means you can answer stupid questions really fast.

And alot of athletes get special privledges especially in HS. I know this cause I used be one of those guys. I never took them and I never needed them being the brilliant individual I am. If you look at a football roster you would be amazed how many guys are undecided, general studies, or native studies.

[Keeper]

Bama really needs to merge the Sportsbuck/Spartan accounts, would make this site so much easier to keep track of.

I have NOTHING against athletes. I'm one myself, and there's a decent chance it could factor in to my ability to get into college. I practice every day, and dedicate a hell of a lot of time into becoming the best I can be. My team is my other family. This is not about me hating athletes.

This discussion started as Freak voicing an opinion about the typical "jock" mentality, one that I believe is a well-found criticism, and many other posters seemed to be in agreement. However, from the start, you were immediately on the defensive. It is no secret that Sean Taylor's death clearly received more attention than it should have - the same can be said for Anna Nicole Smith's death. You then stated that sports are the biggest part of society, something I think is not true, and even if it is true, isn't justification for the topic being discussed.

I made a remark about stupidity, which you immediately jumped on, and then defended what I meant when I said it. Instead of that getting debated, you started stating points that simply are not true, and so the discussion had degenerated as such. You've been proven wrong on several accounts, yet cling to this belief that you are correct, when it simply isn't the reality. You have attacked me for putting words in your mouth, yet have done the same to me.

The facts are simple:
- Athletes receive special treatment in schools.
- Athletes are not under any "more" pressure than other students. Different pressures, yes, but all students face pressures to do well in school, and the argument that student athletes are smarter because of these pressures is simply based in falsehood

The initial discussion was about jocks. I still think a fair deal of them are assholes, who when confronted about why they behave in their manner, dish out backwards logic and make the accuser's argument even more compelling. That's something I certainly stand by.

[detroitbasketball]

Keeper, I believe, is the voice of reason here.

[Keeper]

detroitbasketball said:

Keeper, I believe, is the voice of reason here.

I'm trying.

[JacktheRipper]

sportsbuck2745 said:

For you guys that are saying athletes take easier classes.. guess again.

Closely tied to the GPA is the selection of academic majors. Critics might suggest that athletes' GPA's are high because they enroll in easier academic degree programs, therefore, taking easier classes than their peers. To discover whether this was true, Jones (1995-96) also studied the majors and colleges of the athletes. Results were tabulated and percentages were then used to compare college selection of athlets to non-athletes. The study showed that the student athletes were not selecting what were perceived as easier majors than the general student body. The research has suggested that co-curricular involvement helps create better students. Since the majority of co-curricular participants are involved in athletics, it is encouraging to find that athletic participation does result in higher grade point averages.

Is that talking about college or HS? Sorry, I couldn't figure it out after reading it twice. You cannot compare college athletes to non-athletes, they get personal tutors for pretty much all of their classes and have advantages that non athletes dream of. Same level of class, they still have an advantage going in. Not a valid claim IMO.

Keeper is right on his two facts as well.

Like I said before, I have nothing against athletes. Most of my friends were athletes in HS. They're normal people just like everyone else. My issue in this whole disucssion is the idea that you (Sportsbuck/Spartan) don't think they get special treatment and that is simply false IMO.

[Sportsbuck]

bamarulz2020 said:

sportsbuck2745 said:

For you guys that are saying athletes take easier classes.. guess again.

Is that talking about college or HS? Sorry, I couldn't figure it out after reading it twice. You cannot compare college athletes to non-athletes, they get personal tutors for pretty much all of their classes and have advantages that non athletes dream of. Same level of class, they still have an advantage going in. Not a valid claim IMO.

Keeper is right on his two facts as well.

Like I said before, I have nothing against athletes. Most of my friends were athletes in HS. They're normal people just like everyone else. My issue in this whole disucssion is the idea that you (Sportsbuck/Spartan) don't think they get special treatment and that is simply false IMO.

I have admitted that they get special treatment, but not to the degree that a lot of you say.

I mean, Jesus, most of you are making athletes and jocks out to be axe murderers..

freak93 said:

Also, athletes have a minimum GPA to meet. Let's say that is 2.8. So, if they fall drastically under that, what do they become? Non-athletes. So right there, it is another problem.

And if a non-athlete joins a sports team, they become an athlete..

I'll look at Keeper's post later.

[JacktheRipper]

Dude, I've seen the special treatment happen. Your HS may be different, but I remember that many of the football players didn't have to pay to go to school. I remember a kid who could barely read graduate HS with a 3.0. He was taking regular classes and somehow was pulling better grades than some decently smart kids. I've seen it happen.

Oh and where did I say athletes are bad or like axe murderers? I said most of my friends were/are athletes and I generally hang around with that type. I'm just saying, you're kidding yourself if you don't think they get special treatment.

[Freak93]

sportsbuck2745 said:

And if a non-athlete joins a sports team, they become an athlete..

Their GPA will have to go up to remain at that status.

[JackTheRipper]

As usual, Sportsbuck is defeated and will not concede even though he is quite obviously wrong.

[TJFOR3]

Im late in this conversation, but I'm an athlete and I take easier classes in school so that I have more time for sports and less homework and shit. I just get high 90s in those classes where I could probably take honors classes and still do well, but I'd rather be on the ice or playing golf.

[Sportsbuck]

bamarulz2020 said:

Dude, I've seen the special treatment happen. Your HS may be different, but I remember that many of the football players didn't have to pay to go to school. I remember a kid who could barely read graduate HS with a 3.0. He was taking regular classes and somehow was pulling better grades than some decently smart kids. I've seen it happen.

Oh and where did I say athletes are bad or like axe murderers? I said most of my friends were/are athletes and I generally hang around with that type. I'm just saying, you're kidding yourself if you don't think they get special treatment.

Do you not fully read my posts Bama? I have said that special treatment does occur, just not to the degree that you guys are making it out to be.

And that wasn't directed at you BTW.

But, I'm done arguing this shit. You guys have your own prejudice towards jocks, and nothing will ever change that..