|
|
Post by Colossus Burgers on Nov 14, 2005 13:36:15 GMT -5
|
|
McGahee
All-Conference
Raaraaraa It's A Boy
Posts: 3,684
|
Post by McGahee on Nov 14, 2005 14:07:40 GMT -5
Ortiz got teh robbedorz
|
|
littlet826
All-Conference
A-Rod -- 2005 AL MVP
Posts: 1,460
|
Post by littlet826 on Nov 14, 2005 15:18:54 GMT -5
A-Rod deserves that. Remember its most valuable player to his team. Without Ortiz the Red Sox still have Manny who is a beast. The Yankees without A-Rod have Sheffield probably as their next best and he didn't have that great of a season.
|
|
McGahee
All-Conference
Raaraaraa It's A Boy
Posts: 3,684
|
Post by McGahee on Nov 14, 2005 15:24:14 GMT -5
It's not most valuable to team, or at least it shouldn't be. MVP is the fancy way of saying The Best, and that's what Ortiz was. He had the highest value in the league.
|
|
|
|
Post by Colossus Burgers on Nov 14, 2005 15:28:40 GMT -5
Yeah, but you're forgetting what Manny did littlet. He was worthless 2/3 of the year, but picked it up hugely down the road. Ortiz did everything every bit of the year, and rarely went into a slump.
Without A-Rod, the Yankees still have Sheffield (not that great of a season? Last I checked, .291/34/123 was good) and Giambi, who's back to what he used to do. Matsui also had a pretty good year himself.
|
|
sep
All-American
Posts: 7,153
|
Post by sep on Nov 14, 2005 15:49:36 GMT -5
Of course A-rod won, you dont win the MVP without playing defense, its an unwriten rule.
Now lets go Andruw for NL MVP!
|
|
McGahee
All-Conference
Raaraaraa It's A Boy
Posts: 3,684
|
Post by McGahee on Nov 14, 2005 16:20:53 GMT -5
I think you killed your whole argument for A Rod when you mentioned Andruw and MVP in the same sentnece...
|
|
sep
All-American
Posts: 7,153
|
Post by sep on Nov 14, 2005 16:28:15 GMT -5
I think you killed your whole argument for A Rod when you mentioned Andruw and MVP in the same sentnece... We shall see...IMO Andruw should and will win it. He led a team that at times had 6 or more rookies in the line up. And while Chipper was out for a long period of time with his injuries, Andruw put the team on his back and carried them to yet another division title, it what may have been the toughest division in baseball from top to bottom. |
|
Jami
All-Conference
Posts: 2,723
|
Post by Jami on Nov 14, 2005 17:53:15 GMT -5
Using the justification of Andruw deserving the award because he was the best player on a team of rookies, then Carlos Lee should be a candidate as well. He isn't. Andruw shouldn't get that argument, either. Yes, he led the majors in home runs, but his batting average was horrible. Pujols should be the NL MVP.
Edit: Most of A-Rod's home runs came when the Yankees were already up by 3+ runs. Something like 20 of Ortiz's came after the 7th inning when the Red Sox were trailing. Without Ortiz, the Red Sox were a 70 win team this season. The Yankees were going to the playoffs even if they didn't have Rodriguez.
|
|
sep
All-American
Posts: 7,153
|
Post by sep on Nov 14, 2005 17:54:58 GMT -5
But did Carlos Lee lead a team of rookies to the playoffs... nope.
|
|
Jami
All-Conference
Posts: 2,723
|
Post by Jami on Nov 14, 2005 18:00:45 GMT -5
Andruw Jones had too many 1-4, 1 HR games. Pujols came through in the clutch and led an injury-riddled Cardinals team to the best record in the majors. Jones was helped immensely by Jeff Francoeur (a guy who was a legit contender for ROY), while Pujols was protected by guys like John Rodriguez, John Mabry, So Taguchi, Abraham Nunez, etc. all year long. Pujols was the Cards' offense for much of the year, while Jones was only a part of the Braves' offense.
|
|
nafsder2007
All-Conference
Teh P@ncakes God
Return to Glory?
Posts: 2,256
|
Post by nafsder2007 on Nov 14, 2005 19:11:28 GMT -5
Of course A-rod won, you dont win the MVP without playing defense, its an unwriten rule. Now lets go Andruw for NL MVP! I think Don Baylor did. |
|
sep
All-American
Posts: 7,153
|
Post by sep on Nov 14, 2005 19:13:14 GMT -5
Believe I saw that on SportsCenter yesterday, hes a lucky fellar. |
|
Jami
All-Conference
Posts: 2,723
|
Post by Jami on Nov 14, 2005 19:21:53 GMT -5
Too bad MVP votes were cast before the playoffs started. Think A-Rod would've won after that chokejob of his in the playoffs? What was he, something like 1-for-23? Yeah, those are MVP numbers.
|
|
sep
All-American
Posts: 7,153
|
Post by sep on Nov 14, 2005 19:23:09 GMT -5
Too bad MVP votes were cast before the playoffs started. Think A-Rod would've won after that chokejob of his in the playoffs? What was he, something like 1-for-23? Yeah, those are MVP numbers. And Big Papi did better, his team still got beat in the same round. |
|
nafsder2007
All-Conference
Teh P@ncakes God
Return to Glory?
Posts: 2,256
|
Post by nafsder2007 on Nov 14, 2005 19:23:24 GMT -5
Believe I saw that on SportsCenter yesterday, hes a lucky fellar. Either that, or the ammount of time a player plays has no bearing on his value. Eric Gagne and Dennis Eckersly both come to mind as closers who have won the Cy Young Award, and as we all know, closers are as close to the pitching equivilant of the DH as you can get: they ride the pine except for when they are needed to make some noise. They don't get many appearances in the game, so they have to make the most of them. So I don't think your "No Defense Theory" is valid. Instead, I the voters simply agreed that ARod had a better year, with or without his defense. |
|
Jami
All-Conference
Posts: 2,723
|
Post by Jami on Nov 14, 2005 19:53:31 GMT -5
Except for the fact that a majority of A-Rod's stats came when the game was already decided. If there were a stat for "HR When Your Team Is Up By 5 Runs in the 8th", Rodriguez would lead the league.
|
|
|
|
Post by Cerrano39 on Nov 16, 2005 22:03:40 GMT -5
In the words of Jayson Stark, did defense matter when Frank Thomas, Juan Gone, etc. win?
RISP:
.290/9/77 52K (A-Rod)
.352/7/92 23K (Ortiz)
Close and Late:
.293/4/12 21K (A-Rod)
.346/11/33 15 K (Ortiz)
Ortiz was better against NYY then A-Rod was agaisnt BOS.
I could go one, but a strong case for A-Rod could be made. They both put up very similar stats, their teams, made the playoffs with the same record. I, like Jami, just feel Ortiz's numbers held more importance.
|
|
